Currently I am reading Hägglund’s Radical Atheism with great excitement and a strange sense of affinity. Throughout, Hägglund explores Derrida’s conception of time and its implications. Hägglund’s book is marked, at the outset, with three virtues. First, the clarity of his prose and his argumentation is to be highly commended and is something to be emulated. Second, this is not a slavish book devoted to a pious repetition of Derrida, but develops arguments and lines of thought in its own right. Third, Hägglund develops a realist version of Derrida that doesn’t restrict these claims to the human, texts, or language, but extends it to all life (here I’m left wondering why he restricts these ontological claims to life, rather than going all the way and extending them to all beings).
Throughout, Hägglund explores Derrida’s logic of “autoimmunity”. As Hägglund puts it, “[h]is notion of autoimmunity spells out that everything is threatened from within itself, since the possibility of living is inseparable from the peril of dying” (9). This logic of autoimmunity ultimately issues from the nature of time:
Aristotle points out that there would be no time if there were only one single now. Rather, there must be at least two nows– ‘an earlier one before and a later one after’ –in order for there to be time. Time is thus defined as succession, where each now is always superseded by another now. In thinking succession, however, Aristotle realizes that it contradicts his concept of identity as presence in itself. A self-present, indivisible now could never even begin to give away to another now, since what is indivisible cannot be altered… [A]s long as one holds on to the concept of identity as presence in itself– it is impossible to think succession… Rather, the now must disappear in its very event. The succession of time requires not only that each now is superseded by another now, but also that this alteration is at work from the beginning. The purportedly single now is always already divided by the movement of temporalization in which ‘the dyad [is] the minimum,’ as Derrida contends. (16)
My thoughts are still developing in this connection, but Hägglund’s remarks suggest a way of thinking the split-nature of substance in split-objects. One reason I’ve been unimpressed by critiques of substance that claim that it is incapable of becoming, change, process, etc., is that I already think of substances as activities or processes (this comes out with special clarity in chapter five of The Democracy of Objects where I discuss temporalized structure and entropy). Hägglund helps me to think about this. Every object is internally fissured by its own temporal structure such that it contains non-identity (withdrawal) within itself.
As a consequence, it follows that we must think about identity differently. As Hägglund puts it, “[t]he difficult question is how identity is possible in spite of such a division” (17). Following Bogost, the answer is that we can no longer think identity as pertaining to some unalterable presence in itself, but must rather think identity as an operation on the part of substances. In other words, identity must be an ongoing activity through which a substance reproduces itself across time. Here, again, we find a nice cross-over between Dereck Parfit’s conception of identity and the conception of substances as objectiles advocated by onticology.
August 14, 2010 at 9:28 pm
It excites me that you are reading around Derrida, but I feel compelled to jump in.
I am bearing in that you claim Hägglund develops Derrida’s theory and that it is not a simple restatement. Nevertheless from what you quote it seems to be that Hägglund overlooks or reduces the role that “trace” plays in Derrida’s thought. I would be very grateful if you could give a snippet of how he deals with ‘trace’.
I would like to have a look at a part of the quote you posted with the above in mind…
“Rather, the now must disappear in its very event.”
This to me seems less a development in thinking and more a miss reading, as the ‘now’ does not have its own event in which to disappear into. It would be closer to the mark to say that the now is a simulacrum that points to different directions.
How you develop this point also picks up that what I think is wrong in Hägglund’s quote…
“Every object is internally fissured by its own temporal structure such that it contains non-identity (withdrawal) within itself.”
That in your version of OOP contains multiple substances I can see why it is necessary for you to posit that each object has its own proper temporal structure. What is sacrificed in such a move is that you subordinate ‘non-identity’ to a greater identity which undercuts its status as differing and therefore its alterity in which restores self-presence through the backdoor.
Will.
August 14, 2010 at 9:34 pm
Will,
Hagglund devotes a tremendous amount of time to discussing the trace. I was only pointing to his thesis about time. I don’t understand your final paragraph. I don’t sacrifice non-identity to a larger identity, but claim that identity is an operation. An operation is something that is produced or that takes place. That requires a discussion of trace or preservation.
August 14, 2010 at 11:07 pm
I ought pick this one up. Sounds like Hagglund reads Derrida very much like I do. (Although as a Peircean I do extend the notion you mention to all beings)
Out of curiosity have you read John Protevi’s Time and Exteriority: Aristotle, Heidegger, Derrida. It’s basically a reading of Derrida in terms of a close consideration of time via Aristotle and Heidegger. It’s a tough book in some ways but is a very, very close reading and without all the “derridese” that I think many of us dislike.
August 14, 2010 at 11:41 pm
Ok let me change tack…
Sounding rather Lacanian you state that Hagglund through Derrida on time… “…suggest a way of thinking the split-nature of substance in split-objects.”
The ‘gap’ is produced through two presences otherwise there is no gap or split. Would it be fair to observe that the withdrawn object functions as a kind of objet petit a?
Will.
August 15, 2010 at 6:57 pm
Hagglund has a problem: if things don’t last forever, a Derridean argument could just as easily claim that they don’t really *arise either. If they don’t really arise, they can’t really “survive.”
Darwin (he reads Dennett) also undermines “survival” as a universal category.
Quantum nonlocality undermines the idea of time as a succession of moments, on which Hagglund depends.
I posted on this in two places:
http://ecologywithoutnature.blogspot.com/2010/07/survival.html
http://ecologywithoutnature.blogspot.com/2010/07/survival-2-nonlocality.html
August 16, 2010 at 7:00 am
[…] on Hägglund… Here. He writes: Hägglund develops a realist version of Derrida that doesn’t restrict these claims to […]
August 16, 2010 at 1:36 pm
[…] of mythical animal in the “bestiary” of assholes that OOO is developing. A recent post by Levi is illustrative of the attitude at work: Currently I am reading Hägglund’s Radical Atheism with […]
August 16, 2010 at 3:08 pm
Tim, don’t forget non-locality is one interpretation of Bell’s Theorem but hardly the only one. Also I’m not so sure Derrida is as at odds with non-locality as you suggest. I think it’s very easy to read him in more Leibnizean terms minus the idea of purely independent monads.
August 16, 2010 at 3:12 pm
I agree with Clark here. Put differently, there’s a question of whether or not the sorts of quantum phenomenon here are the result of distinct objects or whether they are one and the same object manifestating itself in two different places simultaneously. Generally, however, I’m wary of these sorts of appeals to QM in argument.
August 16, 2010 at 6:21 pm
Derrida is not at odds. Hagglund is. Derrida refuses to take an ontological position altogether. Hagglund asserted that things survive. What are the non-non locality interpretations of Bell? The empirical evidence is overwhelming that it’s a fact of our reality.
August 16, 2010 at 6:22 pm
…Levi, your correct observation doesn’t affect my position. It doesn’t matter either way. What matters is that time as a sequence of events is epihenomenal.
August 16, 2010 at 6:28 pm
There is a deeper problem with taking the trace in Derrida as a literal account of survival. Let’s follow Hagglund and take it literally, and trace the trace as it were. Is there an origin point? If so, at least this origin is unaffected by the problematic of survival. Hagglund produces a prime mover–hardly radical OR atheist.
Then let’s assume no origin point, traces all the way down and back forever. Then the trace is infinite, coextensive with say a Spinozan God. Radical, but not atheist.
So let’s say neither is the case. Not a very strong position.
This kind of “atheism” is simply nihilism’s refusal to admit that it’s a form of BELIEF.
August 16, 2010 at 6:48 pm
Tim, atheist is a weird word. The difference between the typical deist and the typical atheist is often pretty blurry at best. Most (but not all obviously) atheists seem to be objecting to a personal God.
August 16, 2010 at 6:55 pm
Regarding Bell’s theorem the three interpretations are non-locality, backwards causation or no hidden variable theory. This is pretty standard QM. The idea that there’s evidence that it is non-locality is pretty non-existent. Folks talk about non-locality as a shortcut but the philosophy behind the physics is much more complex than is sometimes discussed. A good book on this is Bell’s own little philosophy book Speakable and Unspeakable in Quantum Mechanics. I should note that Bell favors the background as fundamental in physics and thus privileges QM over GM. I tend to be more on Einstein’s side and adopt a more Leibniz styled approach to objects and also time. So to me I don’t mind backwards causality at all.
August 16, 2010 at 6:57 pm
Tim,
I think I deleted your comment by mistake and can’t find it now (responding by iPhone). Can you repost. I don’t understand your argument here. Hagglund’s traces can be destroyed or erased. That’s a key point. This is very close to ooo’s thesis that objects are equally decomposible into other objects. Also, I don’t think H is arguing that time is succession but that every moment must be internally split to occur.
August 16, 2010 at 7:07 pm
I think Clark may have made my point. Deist used to be a fuzzy way of saying you were an atheist (instead of risking imprisonment etc). Now of course it’s a mode of intelligent design… So it’s pretty all over the place.
Which brings me to Levi’s question–no, you kindly posted my response. Traces can be erased, yes. So if we take this literally to apply to actual life forms and even as you say to objects, does that go on forever to a beginning less beginning (Spinoza, roughly, where survival=conatus) or is there an origin, a first trace, which is somehow exempt (a prime mover)?
My point is simply that in EITHER case what we have is THEISM. And in only one case (Spinozism) is it anything like “radical.”
Which serves to illustrate my hypothesis that nihilism is a form of belief that SAYS that it isn’t one–we are back to good old fashioned postmodern Derrida. Nice try but no cigar for H.
August 16, 2010 at 7:17 pm
Tim,
I still don’t understand the argument. I take it that H’s point is that objects must re-produce themselves from moment to moment using traces and that this is always liable to failure. This is similar to the argument that I make in the structure and entropy section of TDO. I take it that there can be no originary trace but rather there is an infinite regress. I’m not seeing how you are linking this to deism.
August 16, 2010 at 8:31 pm
I have to agree with Levi Tim. I think Derrida clearly accepts infinite semiosis. (Once again even though Levi makes a good point about not reading Derrida too much through Peirce this unlimited semiosis is very key in the texts that Derrida clearly was reading of Peirce)
Now of course one can attack infinite regress. There are famous arguments going back at least to Scotus on this. But I think Derrida’s notion of selection of greater forces demands a position very much like Peirce’s notion of habit. A pattern may persist through changes of context precisely because of those greater forces but it may not.
Like Levi I’m not sure the connection to deism.
August 16, 2010 at 8:36 pm
You agree with me, actually, Levi, that there is an infinite regress. That’s much more honest than H., who is claiming that nothing escapes impermanence, therefore Derrida is an atheist.
OOO is far MORE sophisticated than various nihilisms, including this version of Derrida. It leaves open the possibility that a god might exist. I find theism more honest than nihilism.
Surely H’s secret theism is why Badiouians have fallen for him? They are Catholics after all (he said provocatively).
H. Is in a bind since I’m convinced he wouldn’t like to concede that he was positing an infinite regress. Unless that regress was also subject to impermanence, which would be absurdly paradoxical.
August 16, 2010 at 8:40 pm
2. If it’s traces all the way down, then ultimately there are no objects, only a Spinozan flux called God or Nature. This is radical, but it’s not atheism or OOO.
If however H wants to admit that there is a beginning (this is implied in the idea that objects must sustain themselves–they arose at some point), then his atheism reduces to deism. There is one object exempt from tracing, a prime mover.
August 16, 2010 at 8:43 pm
Clark,
I’ve often gotten the sense that Peirce is an absolute idealist (don’t get me wrong, I’m very indebted to him and have his entire collected works sitting proudly on my shelf). I think there is a case to be made (that has been made) for Peirce as a semiotic realist. Here Peirce and OOO bump heads against one another as for Peirce everything is going to be relational, whereas OOO allows for objects withdrawn from all relation (but capable of entering into relation). That’s a very different debate though. When I was writing my thesis– paradoxically written after my first book –I looked hard for a more sophisticated understanding of Peirce in Derrida. Aside from that handful of remarks you mention in Of Grammatology I just didn’t find it. Moreover, as I already mentioned, he situates these comments in the context of the manifestation of things, thereby, in my view, having signs do the work of sense-bestowing intuitions, i.e., he’s addressing the phenomenological question of the phenomenality of the phenomena or the givenness of the given. Where Husserl has various noetic acts doing this sort of constitutive work, Derrida appears to want signs to do this work.
August 16, 2010 at 8:47 pm
Tim,
My route would be to argue that it’s objects all the way down but that objects are always fissured or split by the form of time. Objects wouldn’t be something that emerge out of traces, but rather each object would have its own trace-structures at work in it. Trace would be the way in which every object withdraws from itself or is non-identical to its local manifestation.
August 16, 2010 at 8:51 pm
3. H’s version of Derrida, I claim, puts him in a bind, neither term of which is strictly Derridean. It’s not a good bind, since each position is mutually exclusive. Derrida himself would have argued that it is strictly undecidable whether there’s an infinite regress or a beginning.
My larger point is that when literalize the trace, you exit Derrideanism. Thus Derrideanism is not to be taken literally. So he really can’t be a friend to OOO on H’s terms.
August 16, 2010 at 8:52 pm
Tim,
Isn’t that a good thing though!
August 16, 2010 at 8:54 pm
Levi: “Objects wouldn’t be something that emerge out of traces, but rather each object would have its own trace-structures at work in it. Trace would be the way in which every object withdraws from itself or is non-identical to its local manifestation.”
There are objects. This is much more than Derrida can claim on H’s terms. It would be dismissed as “ontotheology.”
August 16, 2010 at 8:58 pm
Levi: “Isn’t that a good thing though!”
… So to literalize the trace is to ontotheologize it. I have no problem with this. But H does. So his position is self-defeating.
August 16, 2010 at 9:12 pm
So as a kind of Lacanian point, the content is atheism, but the subject position from which H’s reader gets his argument is theism. The trouble as with Badiou, is that this kind of thing is hypocritical–the theism again is no problem for me.
August 16, 2010 at 9:20 pm
Tim,
I don’t understand how you’re getting to this thesis. How does treating the trace as an ontological feature of beings ontotheologize it? To be ontotheological the trace would have to be a self-identical presence.
August 16, 2010 at 9:21 pm
And it’s entirely possible that I just don’t understand what ontotheology is.
August 17, 2010 at 12:11 am
Okay–well let’s assume that traces aren’t self present. Doesn’t this mean that they can in no sense be objectal, material? How would you observe one? If you could, surely the most you could say about it would be that it’s a superficial phenomenon. If it’s deep, it becomes really existing (self present).
You put your finger on my trouble with Hagglund. He insists that we read Derrida literally and that traces are real. He can’t say that without ontotheologizing.
I’m certain that for Derrida ANY ontological proposition was ontotheological, not just some.
So again: H’s trace is either a superficial effect of real objects (so why all the fuss) OR a deep, fundamental fact that renders all objects moot.
Bad choice, no? I’m reminded of Nagarjuna, a Buddhist philosopher whose arguments somewhat resemble Derrida. He made sure to say, “Anyone who believes that I’m describing actual reality is incurably insane.”
August 17, 2010 at 12:15 am
In a nutshell, trust your anti-correlationist instincts! I’m convinced that “trace,” “gramma,” “arche-writing” etc are EPISTEMOLOGICAL tools, not ontological realities.
August 17, 2010 at 12:23 am
Tim,
I think those are really good questions. A lot of this, no doubt, comes from my background in Deleuze and my treatment of the pure past in Difference and Givenness. There I argued that the past is real, that it persists, that every moment of time simultaneously presupposes a pure past that has never been present and all that. My conception of objects tends to be very process oriented. In TDO I argue that every object faces the “question” of how to perpetuate or continue itself from moment to moment. Put otherwise, every object must solve the problem of how to reproduce itself across time. What excites me about H.’s discussions of the trace is the idea that objects reconstitute themselves out of traces of past phases in their being. In this way, they struggle to stave off entropy or dissolution.
I think you’re right about Derrida and ontology/metaphysics. I’ve always felt, however, that he simply begs the question. He defines ontology/metaphysics as a discourse of presence and then argues that we must move beyond metaphysics. I see this as a failure of imagination. Rather than throwing out the baby (of metaphysics) with the bathwater (of presence) we should instead strive to formulate a metaphysics that isn’t based on presence. I think this is what Deleuze was aiming for with his treatment of the pure past. Moreover, this is what really excites me about Graham’s theses about withdrawal. What we get is a post-ontotheological metaphysics. The argument would thus run that D was right to critique presence and wrong to treat ontology and presence as synonyms. Here we include Derrida in a dialogue rather than piously treating him as a master whose every word is to be slavishly attended to (not accusing you of that, you’re already doing way cool things with D). In other words, we’re relating to his text dialogically and saying “yeah, that’s a really good point and I endorse it, but there’s also these other things!” You know how I feel about the masculine side of the graphs of sexuation. One of the things I detest about Continental thought in the States is how we treat master thinkers according to the masculine side of that graph. Rather than treating them as interlocutors, we treat them as uncastrated subjects who all us castrated thinkers are supposed to piously pore (pour?) over like monks reading the Bible or Aristotle.
August 17, 2010 at 12:24 am
Tim, my friend, I find it ironic that I’m the one defending Derrida here!
August 17, 2010 at 5:55 am
! I see what you’re saying Levi. Forgive my Puritan zeal. It is probably better in some sense to do bricolage and unit operations as one’s MO than the anti-piety approach, which might still be a reaction to the uncastrated version as you say.
I appreciate this back and forth.
Clark, no sensible physicist plumps for backward causality. Nonlocality has been observed in entangled photons and electrons at distances of a few microns (recently at UCSB) and in photosynthesis. Anton Zelinger has entangled photons and removed them to distances including either side of his home town (sorry away from data at present) and on Earth/on board a satellite. If you like Einstein you must love the speed of light–so no backwards causality for you…
August 17, 2010 at 3:52 pm
Tim, how are you using the term “real”? My sense is that you are trying to take it in more naturalist terms.
Regarding causality, as you probably know Feynman diagrams have backwards causality explicitly. You’re right that most physicists see this as a mathematical artifact. Backwards causality is definitely the least popular of the choices. And I personally have no trouble with the idea of non-locality. I just think it important to be clear that one is making a philosophical and not a physical point. (In practice backwards causality and non-locality are indistinguishable at present due to the nature of the speed of light)
Levi, Peirce is an absolute idealist and self-identifies as such (lifting the term from Schelling). However he doesn’t see this as being at odds with realism. He’s pretty emphatic on the realism from. One can dispute whether Peirce is coherent in his realism of course. And lots have, although the typical point of attack is between his realism and his pragmatic maxim.
The issue of relation is a good one and this is, as I mentioned in a prior comment, where I’m most confused about OOP. It seems to me that the potential to enter into a relation is a kind of relation. So I need to get straight how OOP proponents are using relation. This was a point that confused me to no end in Harman’s book. I suspect I’d be more open to your use in that you accept the virtual. But it’s still very confusing to me. I can’t answer the question relative to OOP and Peirce without understanding relation as used by you. With regards to Harman Peirce would have trouble because of the rejection of the virtual. Knowing Peirce, he’d probably call Harman a nominalist (his favorite pejorative comment).
Regarding context, I think that’s why I find your reading a cogent one. I obviously disagree with it because I don’t think the context limits the text that much. That is while I agree with you about Derrida’s focus I think his arguments are more open than that and work fine grafted into a wider context. If Derrida’s argument isn’t incoherent with the wider semiotic and if Derrida doesn’t explicitly limit his position then at best we have an argument from silence plus a contextual argument about focus. That’s fine, but it’s kind of like arguing a mathematician’s position entails the math can only be used in the applications they applied it in. Sort of like saying Euler’s graph theory only applies to trips between islands and can’t apply to computer networks. I can understand why people want to make such a contextual limit. I just think it goes against the very spirit of Derrida’s point about iteration. Not to mention the very nature of philosophical argument which is always intended to be general claims.
August 17, 2010 at 3:55 pm
Tim, I probably should correct one point. While I’m not sure, I suspect the multiple worlds interpretation might well be more popular than the non-local hidden variable interpretation. As I said I fully admit I favor the least popular theory – the backwards causality form most popularized in terms of Cramer’s transactional theory. I guess I’ve just always been a sucker for literalist readings of Feynman diagrams.